Steel2Velvet Posted May 14, 2007 Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 But isn't education the stimulation of thought for the purpose of formulating sound opinion? This is generally accomplished through alterations to existing trains of thought. I suppose one could say they don't come to this site for education, but for recreation; but even during those moments, most find it impossible to close up the learning process completely. I hope I never stop being open to learn anywhere, anytime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Seeker Posted May 14, 2007 Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 I think learning about recording music or baking cookies is very different from learning about religion, because it's based on belief... I don't need to believe in dough or sugar in order to change my opinion on how to bake the perfect cookie, you know? But I do need to believe in God in order to change my opinion on religion in such a way that I'll be converted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daslied Posted May 14, 2007 Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 One should separate "education" from "conversion". I could learn everything about how a chicken functions, but that doesn't mean I'm ready to start shooting eggs from my butt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levis Posted May 14, 2007 Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 I don't know, S2V... no one ever stops learning. It's not something you "turn off" once you log on to Songfacts. But the impression I got from the previous posts is that a belief like Atheism or Agnosticism is wrong. You say you found proof for your belief. But not everyone experiences that. That's all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blind-fitter Posted May 14, 2007 Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 Why is hope for an afterlife seem so sad to you? This hope brings much needed stress relief to a great many people. The same case could be made for masturbation and marijuana, but these are arguably not a solid foundation for a system of religious belief. And when it comes down to it, aren't "hope" and "disappointment" two sides of the same coin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steel2Velvet Posted May 14, 2007 Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 Radhi, did any of those other previous posts give you the imprssion that Cooper's conversion to Christianity was wrong? I guess I am trying to stimulate thought through civil debate rather than humbly accept a view that those who espouse the existence of a Creator to be less enlightened or somehow not able to think for oneself. So many times the rational, scientific approach wins its share of converts as well, from the ranks of those who WANT to believe in God, but are just not sure if it is "cool" to do so anymore. I have been both agnostic and an atheist at points in my life. But I have never been inflexible. I respect a good argument along with a handshake. And my views have absolutely NOTHING to do with "religion." Most organized religions are, as Jesus put it, "whitened sepulchres," brightly reflected tombs full of old bones. I don't desire anyone to "convert" to an organization, but to seek a relationship with the one who created them, in order to find their true purpose in life. If my words seem offensive to anyone - I certainly don't mean it that way. I really love the people I have come to know as Songfactors. All of them. Think of me as a designated driver. A servant now who is a recovering alcoholic. I know what it is like to be wobbly on the barstool; and I'm just trying to help. If you are comfortable driving yourself home, have at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miamisammy29 Posted May 14, 2007 Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 The same case could be made for masturbation and marijuana, but these are arguably not a solid foundation for a system of religious belief. I beg to differ, my blind-fittin' friend. Haven't you ever heard of the "Rastabators", of which I, personally, am a follower? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levis Posted May 14, 2007 Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 Radhi, did any of those other previous posts give you the imprssion that Cooper's conversion to Christianity was wrong? Ah, well, to be honest, the fact that it's the subject of a thread would imply that it's a debatable topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steel2Velvet Posted May 14, 2007 Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 The same case could be made for masturbation and marijuana, but these are arguably not a solid foundation for a system of religious belief. Neither of which ever caused an anxiety attack. Let me stress that I am not discussing religion. The coolest preacher I ever met told me, "Religion is man's way of trying to reach up to touch God, but relationships are God's way of touching humans." The pope is in Brazil right now and I mean to tell you, he needs to smoke a doobie or get alone with himself awhile! Just chill out and let people make their own judgements as to what works in their life! Here's a man devoted to celibacy telling people they aren't having enough babies! Oh well ... Anytime faith is brought up, many start flashing back to a very bad experience with some pompous organization. I find it interesting that the only people Jesus ever got mad at were the "religious leaders." The point of my quoted post you site is that people aren't necessarily helping others by offering implied scientific facts through rationale that really is based in theory itself. When confronting or validating the opinions of those who hold out hope for an afterlife, we must respect that belief as truth as valid as any. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blind-fitter Posted May 14, 2007 Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 Fair enough. I apologise if that comment cheapened an otherwise serious-minded discussion: it was a case of me reverting to frivolous type. Sammy's response was quite amusing though, eh?! Getting back to the issue of Alice Cooper's conversion though. Previously, I had no opinion of "Alice Cooper" (Vince Furnier), either good, bad or indifferent: it has always been pretty obvious that Alice was a creation, a figment of one guy's imagination, a role for playing out (and playing up to) elaborate adolescent fantasies... Now that I discover that his creator has been "born again", my opinion of him is neither enhanced nor diminished. It's just one of those things that happens. What is a trifle irksome is when fervent "believers" claim to pity, shed tears and offer patronising prayers for "non-believers", just because they assume we're heading for hell in a handcart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLizard Posted May 14, 2007 Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 I would never assume someone is going to Hell for their beliefs (or lack thereof), because it's not my place to decide that. I've met a few fundamentalists that tell me I'm going to Hell because I'm Catholic, so I really don't want to pass judgment on others... And hey, I could be wrong about everything, but that wouldn't bother me so much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Posted May 14, 2007 Author Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 I've met a few fundamentalists that tell me I'm going to Hell because I'm Catholic, so I really don't want to pass judgment on others... Liz, I am one as well, that's why I found this hysterical... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLizard Posted May 15, 2007 Report Share Posted May 15, 2007 I've seen that before, but it's funny every time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OLD 55 Posted May 15, 2007 Report Share Posted May 15, 2007 I would never assume someone is going to Hell for their beliefs (or lack thereof), because it's not my place to decide that. Some interesting thoughts there, but I'll only make one comment; that I wholeheartedly agree with Tim on the above. My God is a loving and merciful one. I'll leave judging people for Eternity to Him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OLD 55 Posted May 15, 2007 Report Share Posted May 15, 2007 Tsk, tsk, tsk... if we're getting into debates about these things, why not throw reincarnation in there? I don't believe in it, but at least consider all the options. Can't let this go. I don't either, Radhi, but if there's no God and it's true, I want to come back as a dog with rabies. I might start a list of (Lista) people to bite. Rrrr. I am a little irreverent at times, but I believe my God also has a sense of humor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLizard Posted May 15, 2007 Report Share Posted May 15, 2007 Of course he does. If God didn't have a sense of humor, do you really think humans would exist? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Posted May 15, 2007 Report Share Posted May 15, 2007 I am a little irreverent at times, but I believe my God also has a sense of humor. You're a wise man and a wise guy Darryl. It's never ceased to amaze me what strange vehicles God will use to channel His words. According to scripture, Jesus came to earth to hang-out with and minister to the Alice Coopers of the world... not the Billy Grahams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Posted May 15, 2007 Author Report Share Posted May 15, 2007 Jimmy Buffett My Head Hurts, My Feet Stink, and I Don't Love Jesus My head hurts, my feet stink, and I don't love Jesus (oh my lordy it's that...) It's that kind of mornin' Really was that kind of night Tryin' to tell myself that my condition is improvin' And if I don't die by Thursday I'll be roarin' Friday night Went down to the snake pit To drink a little beer Listen to the jukebox Merle was comin' in clear All of a sudden I wad'n alone Pickin' country music with ol' Joe Bones Duval Street was rockin' My eyes they starting poppin' Because there she sat at the corner of the bar As I broke another string on my ol' guitar Someone call a cab Lady won'tcha pay my tab And now my head hurts, my feet stink, and I don't love Jesus (oh my lordy it's that...) It's that kinda mornin' Really was that kinda night Tryin' to tell myself that my condition is improvin' And if I don't die by Thursday I'll be roarin' Friday night Gotta get a little orange juice And a Darvon for my head I can't spend all day Baby layin' in the bed I'm goin' down to Fausto's get some chocolate milk Can't spend my life in yer sheets of silk I've got to find my way Crawl out and greet the day But now my head hurts, my feet stink, and I don't love Jesus (oh my Lordy it's that...) It's that kinda mornin' Really was that kinda night Tryin' to tell myself that my condition is improvin' And if I don't die by Thursday I'll be roarin' Friday night Let me tell ya, I be roarin' Friday night I mean I'll be Roarin' Friday Night Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Posted May 15, 2007 Report Share Posted May 15, 2007 The Christian By Jimmy Buffett It's a hell of a time to be thinking about heaven Didn't you forget the golden rule You've been acting like Jesus owes you a favor But he's a little smart for you to fool You complain how you forgets the gospel You remind them seek and you shall find Maybe youth will have a time for seeking After they clean up what you left behind Chorus: 'Cause it's a hell of a time to be thinking about heaven Didn't you forget the golden rule You've been acting like Jesus owes you a favor But he's a little smart for you to fool You were right there when the plate was passed last Sunday That's the second time you've been to church all year Could you really call yourself a christian If charity cost half as much as beer Hey You pray a little more as you grow older You get religion as your hair turns gray But you don't need to worry about hereafter Just worry what you're going to do today Chorus: 'Cause it's a hell of a time to be thinking about heaven Didn't you forget the golden rule You've been acting like Jesus owes you a favor But he's a little smart for you to fool Yes my friend I think you've blown your cool Hey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farin Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levis Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daslied Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blind-fitter Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 Neither of which ever caused an anxiety attack. You reckon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiggsUK Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 I never moved so fast in my life as a teenager when hearing the creak of the door-knob... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulGirl Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 i've missed you, diggsy! i used to move fast too, but only to put down my book and switch off the light. that's right folks, i got into trouble for reading too much. i'm such a nerd! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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