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What are your views on gun ownership?


MotoRacerX36

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I own handguns, rifles and shotguns. I have over 30 total. They spend most of their time in my big safe in the garage that weighs over 800 pounds empty. Why do I own so many? Because I like them and I can. Most of the guns I own are of a historical or collectible value. Having been a WW2 collector for over 25 years, a good portion of the weapons I have are of that era. I also have a few very old and valuable Winchester rifles that, someday, may get me out of a jam. A financial jam, that is. Of all the guns I have, there are three that I regularly shoot. They are all used by me at work, so I must remain proficient with them. As far as carrying a gun everywhere I go, I do not, even though I could. If I stay around my neighborhood, I just do not feel the need. If I am going somewhere that has me in a bad part of town, or I even have the possibility of having to stop in a bad part of town, I will think about taking a pistol. This is not out of paranoia, but from experience. Having been a cop for over 16 years, I know that there are some people out there who would like to take what I have. I have always been able to avoid problems by being alert and keeping my head "on a swivel" to avoid being a victim. Most robbers will pick a victim who is not aware of their surroundings or has not noticed them. It is nice to have a back up if needed, though.

For those of you that live in Europe where guns are not very common, consider yourselves lucky. There are plenty of people that have guns here in the US, and a lot of them have them for the wrong reasons. But since America has been around, people living here have had guns and they are not going away. Since it is that way, I do not have a problem with law abiding citizens owning firearms, as long as they go through the proper channels. As it has been said many times, it is not the registered gun owners that you have to worry about, but criminals. And criminals will always find ways to get a hold of guns.

If someone could wave their magic wand and make all the guns disappear, then I would give mine up too. But, that will never happen.

One final point. Even if all guns were taken away, then criminals would just revert to knives, clubs, rocks, whatever is available. There are already a lot of robberies carried out this way, anyhow.

Just try to avoid the hood and keep your head on a swivel.

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It strikes me as amusingly ironic that the country where people are so proud of their right to bear arms is the same country where people say that they must bear arms to feel safe, because other people are bearing arms.

If we weren't allowed to bear arms to begin with, there wouldn't be so darned many arms, and it'd be eleventy hundred times easier to find those who are bearing arms illegally and stop them.

It is, however, too late. The proliferation of arms in the US is ridiculous at this point. Taking them away is absurd.

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MarcM, you just saved me a ton of typing. Thank you.

I own handguns, rifles and shotguns. I have over 30 total. Why do I own so many? Because I like them and I can.

Exactly Marc. That is my primary reason for owning the firearms that I do. Although I don't own quite that many.

As far as carrying a gun everywhere I go, I do not, even though I could.

This is where you and I differ. I feel the need to carry at all time, with the few exceptions outlined in the CC permit rules. I cannot escape the possibility of getting "jacked", pretty much anywhere in this town. If I was at home in Ohio, I would be the same way as you are.

And criminals will always find ways to get a hold of guns.

This has been a point I have been trying to make ever since they took guns away from the citizens in Britan and Australia.

MarcM, thanks for your professional insight on the topic.

I don't want everyone @ SongFacts to think that I condone violence, because I don't. I don't want to shoot someone any more than the next guy. But I am trained enough to handle my firearms safely, effectivley, and with descretion. People, I'm not out there looking for a fight, but I am and will be prepared for one if need be. I guess thats all I'm getting at.

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And yet we don't feel the need to carry guns around in order to feel safe....

Its apples and oranges, really. Britain and Australia have not had the same availability of firearms as someone in the US. Whether we like it or not, guns are a big part of our American culture. Maybe not as much now as when I was growing up, but 30 years ago, just about every kid had at least one toy gun. A lot of kids were given a 22 rifle at the time they turned 13, or whenever they were trusted to handle it properly. Guns have always been here. In societies where gun ownership was strictly controlled or forbidden, it will naturally be easier to control the number of them. Being on an island does not hurt, either.

It is impossible to get rid of all guns, especially where they have been available for over 200 years. Why deprive someone the ability to protect themselves from someone who will not disarm because it is illegal to carry a concealed firearm? I have been to a few places in AZ where it is legal to carry a firearm as long as it is carried openly in a holster. They are not allowed to take their guns into banks or bars, but just about anywhere else. I have to believe that a criminal would think twice about doing anything, not only because their victim may be armed, but also other people that may be around. Being a cop, I like to talk to other cops in my travels. AZ cops have told me that they like having armed citizens because it is a deterrent to criminals, and they do not have nearly as many shootings as in Los Angeles. An armed society is a polite society.

Again, I will say I would happily give up my collection of guns (most of which are never fired) if it meant all guns would disappear. I just do not see that happening. At least in my lifetime.

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Marc, if my memory serves me correctly, Valencia in in CA, right? I want to join the Madison, WI PD, and I know laws and departments varies state to state, but I would really like to PM you with some general law enforcement questions that I have. Let me know if thats cool with you. Thanks.

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Good topic...

I live in what is probably the most conservative state in the US. Looking at the population, it is made up of probably 25% city dwellers, 25% suburban, and 50% rural. I myself live in a suburban/rural area. Most of the men and boys (and a lot of the women) I come in contact with have been hunting and/or shooting since they were children. My own sons began hunting at age 11, the minimum age for deer hunting. It's just what you do here. They have to attend and pass gun safety and hunter education courses before they are allowed to do so. It's the law. I myself can handle a rifle and shotgun. Missouri passed a concealed carry law several years ago. Now that being said, I also live just across the river from what is statiscally the most dangerous city in the US. Many criminals try to come here to commit thier crimes, I suppose thinking they will more easily get away with them. Wrong. It's just not tolerated. I have to say, I feel safer, knowing that there are people around me, that have been properly educated about guns, carrying them. That's not to say that it's some kind of gun totin community. It's not. But I would rather there be a few "good guys" carrying legal, permitted guns, when the are so many carrying illegal and ill-intentioned ones.

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I live in a border city. If I drive less than five minutes I can see some of the taller buildings in Detroit, Michigan. Detroit had scads of murders by gun last year, we (Windsor) had 4. 3 of which were committed by Americans. With guns. Despite that, my opinion is that Americans are normal folk just like myself. Travel away toward Toronto and other points of Canada away from the border (Canada and the U.S. share the longest unprotected border in the world)and the opinion does change. I have heard numerous times the opinion that the Americans are something akin to Yosemite Sam, a shootin' first and a askin' questions last. This is because of the beacons we are given by the media, people like Ted Nugent and Charlton Heston, and the attention drawn to these people by Michael Moore. So the people that do not travel to the 'States have the opinion that they have. They are scared shi*less of you guys. But most of the people I know in this city of 200,000+ view Americans as our friends and allies. I travel to the U.S. often. I find most of you to be friendlier than we are. Your waitresses are friendly and call you "Hon" or "Sugar". People smile at you more. You Americans are the model of hospitality. You make me feel at home. But your "You'll get my gun when you can pry it from my cold dead hands" and "Protected by Smith and Wesson" bumperstickers remind me I am not really at home and that my life and the lives of my family are in a little more danger here. I don't like guns and think only the cops and the military should have them. Living in a border city with Detroit as a neighbor we are inundated with American television. The night of the Columbine tragedy, Bill Bonds (a senior Detroit news anchor) made a long commentary. He ended by saying he "just didn't understand how these kind of things can happen. We'll be back after these messages." (fade to commercial) "This weekend! Michigan's Light Guard Armory! (cue singers) 'Bill Goodman, Gun and Knife show! Bring a buddy, bring a friend!' Knives! Guns!" The screen shows acres of tables of guns, a guy in the background holding up what appeared to be an Uzi, his pal looking at a machete. Leaving me thinking about Bill Bonds last comment and saying, "Uh, Bill, uh, I can see how it might have happened." And on the heels of that, "Why in the good name of Christ would you need a *****ng machete in Detroit? Being a firm believer in the laws of probabilities, your chances of being hurt by a gun escalate drastically by having one.

Respectfully,

Ken.

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I have never owned a gun or seen one other than ones that I've seen on tv. I think we used to have one for shooting rabbits and roos out on my uncle's property. When dad was young I know they went hunting a bit.

Australia has some of the toughest gun laws in the world. The Australian government banned private ownership of most guns in 1996. This was brought about by a nutter who went on a shooting rampage and killed 35 people in a few hours at a popular tourist destination.

Having said that, I feel very safe living in Australia, partly because we are so removed from the rest of the world. Guns have historically played a part in Australian culture - as a pastoral society. Farming is one of our biggest industries and has been ever since the English sent their criminals out here. I think that guns are almost essential in some farming practices, especially where kangaroos and other pests are involved.

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Alcohol and firearms.

When I think about the thousands upon thousands of people who use alcohol responsibly, yet a small fraction use it, too much, get in an automobile and kill themselves or worse, someone else.

It's the same thing with guns.

I have a shotgun and a .22 rifle up and out of reach and not "in" my house, the ammunition is separate. I have not shot them in many years. Someday I may go out into the wilderness again and target shoot. Why, I don't know it's fun to.

I doubt I would ever possess a handgun, but I don't believe that "no civilians" should own them. Should the law be tight? Absolutely!

I'm not sure our problems in the US stem from our gun laws, but maybe, rather from our punishment laws. Maybe the way some parents look after their children, or don't.

Fact is, bad people will get guns even if they are outlawed, and innocent people will not be able to defend themselves. Police can't do it all.

I'd be willing to review a test of it though.

San Francisco is currently under test, A ban in Australia is still under evaluation.

Here is an interesting read ..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_control

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My opinions on this subject can be summarised pretty easily with statistics.

In 2001, firearms were used to murder 6 people in New Zealand, 56 in Japan, 96 in Great Britain, 168 in Canada, and 331 in Germany. In comparison, firearms were used to murder 11,348 in the United States.

For every time a gun is used in a home in a legally-justifiable shooting [note that every self-defense is legally justifiable] there are 22 criminal, unintentional, and suicide-related

shootings.

I still haven't found exactly how many gun homicides per year occur in Australia, but I know for a fact the number is pretty much insignificant compared to the US.

I honestly don't care that some people have guns in Australia who probably shouldn't and yet I can't. The important thing is that the percentage of the population who are trigger happy gun owners here is much smaller than any country where guns are legal.

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Lets look at some other numbers to keep things in perspective. Here, according to our friends at the CIA, are the population numbers for the following countries:

USA - 295,734,134

Japan- 127,417,244

Germany- 82,431,390

Britain- 60,441,457

Canada- 32,603,019

Australia- 20,090,437

New Zealand- 4,035,461

For the 295,734,134 in the USA, there are probably twice as many guns. I think 11,348 is low number. Of course, it is still unacceptable and a tragedy to each family.

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so that means we have (murder with firearms per million in 2001)

USA - 37,8

Canada - 5,25

Germany - 4,04

UK - 1,6

New Zealand - 1,5

Japan - 0,44

I think 11,348 is low number

You may think so - I don't...

For every time a gun is used in a home in a legally-justifiable shooting [note that every self-defense is legally justifiable] there are 22 criminal, unintentional, and suicide-related shootings.

but I think that is much more interesting

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With as many people as there are that do not value life (theirs or yours) and relatively easy access to firearms in the US, yes, I think it is a low number. I would have thought that there would be more. I still believe that criminals and people that want to kill themselves will find a way to accomplish their goals whether there are firearms or not. I can not say the same for people that accidentally shoot themselves, though they may find other ways to remove themselves from the gene pool.

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In a place where any Joe Schmo can walk up behind you, put a gun to your head, and pull the trigger because of the kind of car you have, or the watch on your wrist, I'm not going to wait for the police to show up to defend me...

In this eventuality, having some shotguns in the gun-cupboard at home and a pistol concealed in your inside jacket pocket isn't going to help much really, is it? Perhaps if he didn't live in a place where guns were revered, glamourised and, let's face it, so easy to procure, Joe Schmo wouldn't have a gun to press into the back of your head in the first place?

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Most everyone is thinking in "best of all worlds" terms. Of course it would be better not to have the proliferation of guns here. The fact remains, that due to our history and culture, we do have them. None of us can change that now. You could completely outlaw guns here and in no way would that get rid of the guns. The only thing to do now is deal with the situation we have. I am in no way a gun advocate, never has there been a handgun in my family. But I would never try to tell someone else what to do. I do advocate education and knowledge about guns, if you are going to posess one. I think knowledge gives you a healthy amount of respect. An awful lot of those accidents and shootings happen because people don't have the knowledge and respect for guns that they should.

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