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Disco died pretty quick...why is Rapp still alive?


Mike

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I believe that in a reverse situation with that question whether Classic Rock sucks and to give good bands, maybe the answer would be The Who, Led Zeppelin etc. Don't you think the Hiphop fan would think "Jesus - that's crap"?

No.. Cause those are the songs they use to sample their own songs from! ;)

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That might be the case for the occasional rapper, but the average fan doesn't even know where a sample comes from. Or worse they wouldn't even recognize it as a classic rock sample.

When I was at my friends (a HipHop fan), when Puff Daddy's "Come with me" came up on TV (or Radio, I don't remember). And I said hey, that's Kashmir, he first didn't know what I was talking about, since he never heard of this song. He only knew Led Zeppelin from the name and best of all he thought that Puff Daddy composed the song himself.

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Well, it's not just because I don't like it.

It's like disco had a sound that never changed. It never "evolved" if you will, so it (in my opinion) ran it's course, and ran out of gas.

Rock evolves, pop evolves, country evolves, heck even contemporary orchestral music has evolved.

But Hip/hop? The only thing that changed is the lyrics. It all sorta sounds the same. A least as little as I've tolerated to listen to, am I being narrow?

Ah, the old "it all sounds the same to me" argument. In response, I have to say this: have you ever talked to someone who just hated rock? If you ever do, ask them why they hate it, I can almost guarantee you they'll say "it all sounds the same to me, it's just a bunch of screaming and distortion." This statement, of course, is false. Rock is a genre that includes Elvis, Black Flag, Genesis, Iron Maiden, Pink Floyd, Jethro Tull, Funkadelic, Radiohead, Queen...these bands all sound different, of course. So why do rock-haters say "it all sounds the same?" The answer is lack of knowledge. Many of these rock haters do not realize that rock goes beyond the confines of the crap that MTV feeds them.

Now back to hip hop...it definitely does NOT all sound the same. I mean, it's a genre that includes Outkast, De La Soul, NWA, Eminem, Dr Dre, the Streets, DJ Shadow, Gorillaz, A Tribe Called Quest...these guys all sound very different. When people say rap all sounds the same, it's most likely due to lack of knowledge. Either that, or intolerance of anything without vocals...or possible intolerance of anything without instruments (don't even get me started on techno-haters). Many people don't realize that rap goes beyond the confines of the crap that's on MTV.

Of course, if you've heard a good bit of rap, and genuinely don't like it, there's nothing wrong with that, and I can't argue with that. However, saying it "doesn't evolve" and "all sounds the same" is completely ridiculous.

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If a person claims not to like it and not to listen to it, he or she obviously has not heard every song or artist. I don't believe it is possible to judge a whole genre of music without having heard more than a few snippets of a couple of songs.

Obviously you can't judge a genre without hearing all of the best artists and songs. However, when you are talking about rap, there is so much of it around that it's pretty much impossible not to hear all the hits, unless you live under a rock. Rap fans often tell me "I bet you have only heard about five rap songs before", but the in reality is the number I have heard is closer to 500 (beginning to end, several times in most cases, with only a tiny hint of exaggeration), and I hate pretty much all of them. I can't think of any popular rap artists that I haven't heard much of, with the exception of Grandmaster Flash. Perhaps I should just listen to a few of his songs to reinforce my argument.

Anyway, the longevity of rap and the diminishing quality and popularity of the better forms of music are mostly the fault of the big record producers. They continue to accept and promote loads of rap and hip hop artists, while only accepting others if they are "radio friendly", and doing pretty much nothing to promote them.

Didn't disco die out after a huge "Disco Sucks" demonstration? Do you reckon if we got enough people we could do the same with rap and hip hop?

Maybe disco will re-evolve from modern dance music some time soon. On the other hand, it might take a while longer for modern pop and rock to evolve back to how it was back in the good old days (ie. years before I was born).

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As long as the youth (and some of the older) do drugs rapp will stay alive. I am inclined to believe rapp singers and rapp listeners are stoned to some degree.

I coould be wrong. This is just one man's personal opinion. To my mind rapp is crap, it can never be music in my dictionary.

It's my conviction that of all races, people of African origin are the ones with music in their blood, yet is it disheartening to note that most rappers are of the same origin

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Well, it's not like rappers are the only musicians who do drugs...what about all the 60's rockers? And 70's rockers? And 80's, 90's, and 00's rockers? Many of them do drugs as well.

I think one of the best things to come out of rap so far is how other genres have picked up parts of rap, such as good beats. For instance, an alternative band, Flaming Lips, mixed their psychedelic folk pop with trip hop, and made "Yoshimi Battles The Pink Robots," one of the greatest masterpieces of our time if you ask me.

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Well, it's not like rappers are the only musicians who do drugs...what about all the 60's rockers? And 70's rockers? And 80's, 90's, and 00's rockers? Many of them do drugs as well.

There you´re more than right... people of my age know how much this is true, rock in the sixties and seventies was basically "sex and drugs and rock and roll", though the line might be from the late seventies (I believe...)

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I am no authority on drug use by rockers of the 60's and 70's to make an incisive statement - I just put in my two cent worth for this thread. However, I would like to add that rockers of these decades were prescription users who later became addicts. I may go so far as to say that current day drug users (rappers included?) are users/addicts by choice.

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Rap is not music. It has no melody and no vocals, therefore, it is not music anymore than a poetry recital is. Rap is (for the most part), bad poetry with a little rhythm thrown in for good measure. Obviously, many people like it and that's great. Whatever floats your boat. I just get really annoyed when people refer to Rap as music.

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Of course, if you've heard a good bit of rap, and genuinely don't like it, there's nothing wrong with that, and I can't argue with that. However, saying it "doesn't evolve" and "all sounds the same" is completely ridiculous.

I've loved you forever, Batman, but I feel the need to share it publicly now. :bow:

Batman's favorite hip hop song if anyone's interested: Outkast - "Bombs Over Baghdad"

Great song, Batman.

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Whether or not you consider rap to be "music," it is without a doubt an artistic expression, and a culturally original one at that. Growing up in the inner city streets of these predominantly black communities, it is/was one of the only forms of artistic expression these talented individuals knew/know. You can't blame them for only doing what they know, can you? When you are raised in a violent and sexist environment, then naturally some of that is reflected in your lyrics.

How would these aspiring artists afford (or access) traditional musical instruments? How could they get music lessons? The best most of them could do is sample other music to freestyle over, or have others "beatbox" for them. What they created was something that they could call their own - something not yet tainted by white corporate America.

Disco was a fad. Everyone knew that. Rap's roots lie much deeper. It's not going anywhere.

Some great rap/hip-hop lyricists/emcees

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wub.gif

Anyways, CanAm, I disagree. A lot.

This is silly. Rap has a beat, rythym, and melody, therefore it is music.

Well, rap definitely has melody, even if the rapper isn't the one creating the melody. As far as the whole "no vocals = no music" thing, here is a link proving that statement incorrect. Here's more proof, just to be on the safe side.

Saying that rap is not music is one of the most closed minded comments I hear on a day to day basis. If you don't like it, fine, I don't like a lot of it either, but there's no denying that it is music, and an art form.

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For every so called expert source you can find to claim that Rap is a valid musical form, I can find one to refute the claim. It is certainly your right to disagree with me, just as it is mine to vehemently disagree with you. People are free to like what they like, but I find it a sad commentary on society today that there are so many people who like artists (and I use the term loosely in this context) whose lyrics are (in many cases) misogynistic and violent.

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I thought long and hard prior to writing this. The question stands why is rap still popular. Music has always been a form of communication. The artist communicates a feeling / experience and we, the listening audience shuns / embraces it as ours. It speaks to us. I won't speak for anyone but myself. I don't like 95% of the hip-hop / rap artists or selections. But, I don't think I am supposed to. The music (and yes, I believe it is music) isn't aimed at me. I don't fit the demograph. A long time ago my younger brother-in-law loved Ice-T (I think it was Ice-T), and begged me to listen to some of it. I had to laugh because Ice-T was rapping about killing white people. I pointed this out to Jason, he told me I didn't 'get' it. Ok. He's right, I didn't. A lot of rap's content doesn't apply to me. And I am not racist in the least. A large chunk of my CD collection is comprised of black artists. But they represent a different genre. But hip-hop / rap continues to flourish because of the large urban market. That demograph, 'gets' it. I think Public Enemy, and in particular, Chuck D. got the message across large with "Fear Of A Black Planet". Songs like "911 Is A Joke"

Hit me

Going, going, gone

Now I dialed 911 a long time ago

Don't you see how late they're reactin'

They only come and they come when they wanna

So get the morgue embalm the goner

They don't care 'cause they stay paid anyway

They teach ya like an ace they can't be betrayed

I know you stumble with no use people

If your life is on the line they you're dead today

Late comings with the late comin' stretcher

That's a body bag in disguise y'all betcha

I call 'em body snatchers quick they come to fetch ya?

With an autopsy ambulance just to dissect ya

They are the kings 'cause they swing amputation

Lose your arms, your legs to them it's compilation

I can prove it to you watch the rotation

It all adds up to a funky situation

So get up get, get get down

911 is a joke in yo town

Get up, get, get, get down

Late 911 wears the late crown

911 is a joke

Everyday they don't never come correct

You can ask my man right here with the broken neck

He's a witness to the job never bein' done

He would've been in full in 8 9-11

Was a joke 'cause they always jokin'

They the token to your life when it's croakin'

They need to be in a pawn shop on a

911 is a joke we don't want 'em

I call a cab 'cause a cab will come quicker

The doctors huddle up and call a flea flicker

The reason that I say that 'cause they

Flick you off like fleas

They be laughin' at ya while you're crawlin' on your knees

And to the strength so go the length

Thinkin' you are first when you really are tenth

You better wake up and smell the real flavor

Cause 911 is a fake life saver

So get up, get, get get down

911 is a joke in yo town

Get up, get, get, get down

Late 911 wears the late crown

Ow, ow 911 is a joke

I can say I might like the cadence of the song, but there is no way I can say I understand it. When I call 911, an ambulance or a cop car shows up, and fast. I'm not saying that to be crude, it is the plain truth. But Chuck D. has every right to be angry and is getting the word out as to what is happening in his corner of the world. On the other hand, I saw Snoop Dog(g)? on Saturday Night Live a while ago and had no clue as to what he was singing about. Fair enough. I don't suspect he would share my angst, or the way I identify with Seger's "Feel Like A Number" or "Against The Wind". 2 separate worlds, 2 separate realities. But both worlds exist, and coexist. And everyone is listening to the messages. I tried to be eloquent, and failed. Sorry.

Ken.

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