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Farin

'27 dead' in Connecticut primary school shooting

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Also... "so what is a person to do when a criminal with a gun breaks into their home at 3:00 AM? Die? Or defend themselves?" does this really happen?

Are you seriously asking whether home burglaries happen?

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A surprising fact is that gun ownership in the United States is decreasing rather than increasing. Political scientist Patrick Egan notes: "For all the attention given to America’s culture of guns, ownership of firearms is at or near all-time lows ... long-term trends suggest that we are in fact currently experiencing a waning culture of guns and violence in the United States."

And Shawna, you maybe correct. I personally sleep very light, Any noise and I'm up, and alert. But I may not be able to kill in self defense, in defense of my family, I hope I never ever find out. I'd never be cocky and assume anything.

Maybe video games and films with violence actually provide a release for some, and might prevent them acting out in real, because they get to "pretend". I love racing games but I know better than to try and drive 120 mph on the express way.

I do think if we can send troops to Iraq to protect foreigners, we can afford to have a troop at every school. It may not prevent a massacre, but I think the cost of not at least trying it, may be too high. It's worth a few billion dollars to protect our most treasured civilians. That's my opinion!

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Yes, nothing screams "everything is okay, kids" more than turning our schools into armed encampments, complete with gun-toting military personnel.

Why not just turn the U. S. into a police-state while we're at it, and put armed military personnel EVERYWHERE. Even in your bathroom, to make sure you put the toilet paper on the roll correctly.

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As a high school student, I'll chime in here. My high school is staffed by a fully-equipped police officer. He's friendly, but I wouldn't mess with him--I've seen what happens when a fight breaks out. Also, we have a few security guards at the school, but they're more for hall duty and are only armed with a walkie-talkie. The middle school also has a School Resource Officer, but they didn't get one until last year. The High School's had one for a long time.

The high school isn't really in the best area. It's right on the border between two neighborhoods, neither of which are the best places to live. Despite this, I never really feel threatened in school. In order to get in, one MUST be let in by a security guard who then takes you to the office. All the doors are locked.

I don't feel that this is a problem. I don't feel as if my freedom is threatened.

I just have a feeling that the two Elementary schools are going to get SRO's as well in the wake of this tragedy.

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Are you seriously asking whether home burglaries happen?

People breaking into houses when they think they're empty in order to steal stuff and people breaking into houses knowing the occupants are at home practically expecting to inflict bodily harm on them to steal stuff are two completely different things. And yes, I didn't know that the latter was a very common way criminals are working... I never heard about that before, apart from the odd movie plot. :P

Thanks for explaining, Shawna.

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A burglar can think the house is empty and be wrong. It's in those instances people who legally own firearms will use them to defend themselves, if the burglars aren't scared off by the fact the homeowner is home and armed.

Yes, it's rare for someone to try and rob a house they know is occupied - that usually only happens when it's drug-related, and the thieves are trying to get drugs and/or money from whoever is in the house or apartment.

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Also it's just not true. Animals kill their own kind all the time. There are territorial fights, eg. Or pack animals where a new alpha male kills the offspring of his predecessor.

THE POINT IS they don't need guns to do it.

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What's one mass shooting that has been prevented by a 'good guy with a gun'?

Actually hang on - how many other countries have mass shootings? The last time we had one was when the British opened fire on an unarmed peaceful protest in Amritsar. That was in 1919.

We had a school shooting in 2007 (in my city, in fact - couple of kilometres away from my house) - one kid nicked his father's gun and shot a classmate. That was about it.

Of course, since I'm not American and not talking about America, I doubt this is of interest to anyone (India? Isn't that where curry comes from?)

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Maybe I'm reading it wrong, but it sure sounds like you're trying to make the point that other countries/people are better than Americans because they don't have the gun problem that we do.

Also, of course animals don't need guns to kill other animals. They have claws, sharp fangs, poison, and other evolutionary ephemera to aid them. We don't. That doesn't make animals inherently better. I'd say that we're slightly better only because we crap in toilets.

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Maybe I'm reading it wrong, but it sure sounds like you're trying to make the point that other countries/people are better than Americans because they don't have the gun problem that we do.
I thought her point was that other countries have stricter gun laws and have less gun violence as a result.

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What's one mass shooting that has been prevented by a 'good guy with a gun'?

Actually hang on - how many other countries have mass shootings? The last time we had one was when the British opened fire on an unarmed peaceful protest in Amritsar. That was in 1919...

Have you been living under a rock? Norway had one of the worst mass shootings in the world. All the gun laws in the world didn't prevent that one from happening hahahah :beatnik:

More people die from automobile accidents than they do with mass shootings? Solution: ban cars. Hell, more people die from combining booze and driving? Solution: ban booze! Yeah, let's see what else we need to be protected from.

I'd go insofar as to use the same quote from Ben Franklin...

You deserve neither freedom nor protection if you're for the state/govt. passing more and more laws to "protect" you :beatnik:

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The actual quote is "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." I don't know if he would consider the right to recreationally shoot stuff an Essential Liberty.

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I paraphrased the saying. I think the gist of it is still there. Anyway, are automobiles and booze "essential liberties"? What IS an essential liberty?

More people die in logging accidents than in mass shootings. We should ban logging. Is logging an essential liberty? Come on :beatnik:

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Again - and I hate that I keep having to say this - these are false analogies. None of these products are specifically designed to kill. Guns are.

Automobiles are specifically designed for transportation, but some people don't use them specifically for that: street racing, drunk driving. Therefore, ban cars and booze. For you, guns "are specifically designed to kill." For others, they're used for sport, for hunting, for collecting, and for other reasons - none of our business, really, as long as they're abiding by the law(s) :beatnik:

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here is a couple things wrong with some thoughts...

first, we are not talking about "other countries" here, we are talking about America, a very different country from all the others. So YES, we have freedoms that are going to *inherently* be challenging to deal with than other nations.

second, because of the structure of Americas freedoms, bad people will be able to very simply obtain guns, 30 round clips, drugs, whatever, regardless of the laws you create, and there are even more laws here to protect them if they are caught with or using these same items.

third, we are a country right now of "voluntary military", meaning our legal citizens have the right to bear arms of any kind, and this is necessary to maintain civil order, look, we have reduced our police force to near nothing in the last 40 years per capita, if you want to control crime, you better not start controlling guns, it's what keep the bad guys thinking... "does the victim have a gun?"

any criminal would much rather face police,a court, jury, guard, parole board... than a victim with a gun!

so it's tragic that we have an occasional lunatic kill with a gun, what you're missing is the facts of what guns really means to our culture in terms of security, if you have a bias agenda for either pro-gun or anti-gun, I assure you you are missing critical data that would help you understand the truth. I spent years researching before i made my decision to own and carry a handgun, YEARS, I was concerned, I was apprehensive, but I educated myself, without pride or prejudice, and I keep an open mind. It was not a selfish decision, my families safety tipped the scale.

peace

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