_Laurie_ Posted July 5, 2008 Report Share Posted July 5, 2008 Yep, that was it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poetrychick Posted July 6, 2008 Report Share Posted July 6, 2008 Ring around the rosie A pocketful of posies Ashes! Ashes! We all fall down. A bit morbid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otokichi Posted July 6, 2008 Report Share Posted July 6, 2008 (edited) http://www.snopes.com/language/literary/rosie.asp Snopes says "Ring Around The Rosie" ISN'T about The Black Death/Bubonic Plague. Edited July 6, 2008 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otokichi Posted July 6, 2008 Report Share Posted July 6, 2008 http://www.bardsguild.com/filk/4and20virgins.htm This link, however, is to a song that has been credited to Robert Burns, and performed live by Jim Croce at his last concert. (It's just so full of images, said he.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poetrychick Posted July 7, 2008 Report Share Posted July 7, 2008 (edited) Burns. Now there's a good writer. "Comin' Thro' the Rye", read it. Edited July 7, 2008 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blind-fitter Posted July 7, 2008 Report Share Posted July 7, 2008 Ring around the rosie A pocketful of posies Ashes! Ashes! We all fall down. A bit morbid. You see, over here we say "Ring, a ring of roses, A pocket full of posies, Atishoo! Atishoo! We all fall down" The "ring of roses" refers to the rosaceous skin-rash, which was the first symptom of illness. I'm not sure of the significance of posies, but then sufferers would develop flu-like symptoms "Atishoo! Atishoo!", prior to popping their clogs. ("We all fall down") Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farin Posted July 7, 2008 Report Share Posted July 7, 2008 (edited) when I tried to google for a possible meaning of the posies line, I stumbled across a snopes article about the rhyme... EDIT: okay, so maybe I DO need to read every post carefully before engaging into the conversation Edited July 7, 2008 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Posted July 7, 2008 Report Share Posted July 7, 2008 http://www.snopes.com/language/literary/rosie.asp Snopes says "Ring Around The Rosie" ISN'T about The Black Death/Bubonic Plague. I'm not at all convinced by their reasoning . At the time of Chaucer /The Black Death, and both earlier and later , common stories and other information were rarely recorded in books except that which were considered to be of note or of some importance ( meaning a paying patron ) due to the cost and effort involved . A children's rhyme could very likely be omitted or ignored , yet I can easily imagine children making a game or play of such a serious event of what they saw happening around them - eventhough it likely orphaned many of them , since disease or sickness was a constant companion for them . That's part of the charm of children , though it may not have interested adults . In fact ," childhood" and attention toward it , as we know it in a modern sense , doesn't really begin to take any form until the Victorian Era . Prior to that , it was either ignored or exploited in some form of servitude as soon as possible . Their thoughts, feelings, or words rarely , if ever , appear . Part of what made Dickens a hit was the revolutionary idea of considering what children may think . I think it highly likely that children could concoct a rhyme that passes through hundreds of years in order to make sense of what they saw or feared around them - and for it to be ignored as nonsense by adults ( responsible for recording literature ) for a long period of time , as well as the variations that appeared , since we have a thread going that clearly shows how people hear things differently and may even modify a song over time , sometimes deliberately . Remember that Homer's Iliad must have survived a long period of time in a mostly oral tradition until it was recorded . Is it an accurate retelling of a real conflict or mostly fantasy , or a twisted version of both ?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Posted July 7, 2008 Report Share Posted July 7, 2008 You see, over here we say "Ring, a ring of roses, A pocket full of posies, Atishoo! Atishoo! We all fall down" The "ring of roses" refers to the rosaceous skin-rash, which was the first symptom of illness. I'm not sure of the significance of posies, but then sufferers would develop flu-like symptoms "Atishoo! Atishoo!", prior to popping their clogs. ("We all fall down") Since the Plague was considered to be carried by foul air , people carried flowers or nosegays ( think today of items such as oranges studded with cloves , or a small bouquet which also have their origins in this belief ) which they believed would keep them safe. As a kid in Canada , we also mimicked the sneezing word rather than saying ashes - 'a-choo ' . A bride carries a bouquet not only to look pretty and as a symbol of fertility , but to keep herself 'safe' in a large gathering . Also the corsage for the groom . http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nosegay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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